Why did MS leave power on the table with Xbox Series X and S?

Lots of things to unpack here.

overclocking means increased cooling. Getting the parts they did in the compact form factor they were able to is quite impressive. Especially if you compare it to the size of the playstation 5 which is simply ungodly in scale. Because of the formfactor you would have to consider ram, nvme, etc all the components would be under increased duress. So just because you can overclock something doesn’t mean you should. Lastly, overclocks are something they could adjust with updates if they so chose too. In theory, if cooling allows they could adjust the clocks at will. Lastly inregards to higher clocks. Higher clocks mean dimminished yield as all chips then have to reach the overlocked speed.

Series S probably will be a 1440p machine once super resolution is out in the wild. Many of the RDNA 2 features that would allow games to reach 1440p resolution simply wont be available in backwards compatible titles. However, as we see new releases which can take advantage of the full feature set you will see more titles hitting 1440p 60.

One thing I feel like you aren’t giving the series s enough credit for is that it can play more 120hz titles than even the ps5 does. Its a fairly robust machine for the price you are paying.

The TDP can reach that range, see Gears 5 for example.

But what’s happening with these games is that SX is severely under performing, be it because of tools or something else.

If you look at TDP it’s low utilization of the GPU.

Ms can “force” higher utilization by increasing the clocks. Of course the clocks will be different on a game by game basis.

You see an example of this in the X /S itself already with SMT vs Non-SMT clocks.

It might just be for BC titles since they would benefit the most.

You have to release these consoles at affordable prices

In an ideal world we get 600-700 Consoles that are significantly more powerful

Choosing series S to play third party games may not be the best choice in a long run ( only super resolution can save it in that regard ).

For First party and casual third party games - it’s a perfect choice.

Also, enlasita have done some preliminary tests and 45 fps is just uncapped framerate with minimum fps of 45 on PS5. So same maybe the case for series S and X.

Those series S power figures is giving me hopes for a handheld

Does anyone really see the Series S lasting the full generation and being able to keep up?

I do, when devs will use even a fraction of GDK and they won’t do simple port from PS versions (like any japan dev does every time, I’m curios to see if RE8 will be broken like RE3 at launch) and/or brute force Xbox One code, Series S won’t have any problem at all, PC min requirements won’t surpass Series S for many years to come. If you see the power consumption analysis from DF, every cross gen game uses more than 200 watts on ps5, no xbox series game goes over 140 aside from Gears 5, which is a first party and a technical masterpiece. No one is using even a fraction of Series console power, I hope MS will mandate something, because in some cases the underuse it’s ridicoulus.

I’ve never understood why devs are always so slow to adopt xbox devkits: with the Og xbox one, outside firsr party, no one ever used the esram to help the ddr3 pool, with xbox one x, devs begin to use it really 1 year after (or never in some cases, forced parity ftw), with series console it’s the same, when in the ps case every time the results are immediate. Is MS ineptitude the problem or there is more?

They’ll release a revision of the Series S well before the Series X. I don’t even think Microsoft is happy with the performance some of the newer titles are receiving on it. It’s already surprised me and I had high expectations for it.

How would a newer revision ‘fix’ the Series S already sold? Every game has to run on it.

It would generate unpredictable situations, not something you wish on a cool silent console. On top of that, not all SOCs from the wafer are the same quality. By under clocking you can use more, that otherwise wouldn’t have made the cut, and save on costs.

Like the gay man said to the right wing extremists:I don’t need fixing.

Really the series S is fine. Especially in a post Covid and chip shortage world.

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Exactly. The Series S is below 200mm² while PS5 is above 300mm²

That’s 50%more.
On the other hand, the Series X is 360mm² and just 20% more than PS5

Plus at the higher clock speed, you’ll be throwing more chips away than at a lower clock. This is due to them becoming less stable stable at a higher clock. Heck if Microsoft really wanted, they could reuse series X SOCs that didn’t make the cut, as series S SOCs by disabling gpu compute units and bandwidth lines and lowering the clock speed.

The user wouldn’t be able to tell the difference.

But since the series X is clocked lower, the yield between PS5 and Series X might actually be surprisingly similar. One is larger but the other is clocked higher so faults might actually even out.

Series S with a node shrink would be stunning in power use though.

That moment when they can get it to 199 with a pack in game or few months of gamepass? That’s when we are talking sales.

CPU wise it’s equal to PS5 and series X.

The place where it might struggle is Memory (Bandwidth/capacity) and GPU ( resolution/RT)

For memory - SFS and velocity architecture is worked on

For GPU - super resolution is worked on

I can see it struggling in it’s 5-7th year of the gen. But that will only happen for third party ambitious games.

The series S is a Gamepass and first party machine. And should be purchased for that purpose alone.

If one want to be sure of having its third party games running perfectly by the end of gen - should have purchased series X.

By the way, by the end of of gen even the series X will start to struggle. But series S will look more bad.

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Why not?

It has the highest flop/pixel count of any of the next gen machines, in a generation where even geometry will be bound by native resolution.

This isn’t an 1S vs 1X situation where 1X was better at 4k than 1S was at 1080p. SS is more capable at 1080p than SX (or PS5) are at 4k.

Add ML resolution scaling and the difference may be even less pronounced.

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I don’t understand at all what “keeping up” or “lasting’ even means in certain contexts here. I don’t believe there will be games that “skip” the series S that release on series x. just like there wasn’t games that skipped the one S or ps4 slim. I am pretty sure most folks who bought a series s, bought it cause they prioritize other things than raw performance or graphics to begin with. I don’t think we will reach games that are “”“unplayable””" on series S for a long time and by then we will be talking about whatever new Xbox or midgen system is coming out anyways.

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When they utilize the capabilities yes. Especially as a 1080p 1440p system.

Even the series x has barely been touched as far as potential.

If the switch can still be a relevant console in 2021 the series s can be relevant in 5 years time. Of course it will start to show it age but can still run the bare minimum.

The 1s and base xbox had horrible CPUs and outdated GPUs. The series s still has one of the fastest cpu for a console. The gpu memory won’t be an issue for lower res. And the memory bandwidth is more than enough. Maybe not for ray tracing. But most games have options of no tracing.

The one x is one of the most bottlenecked consoles of all time. A beast of a GPU with a garbage tier CPU.

The cut down chips end up in consumer consoles. The perfect chips end up in development kits.

And then there is also the Cloud blades that will get Series X chips. I’m just not sure yet if it will be cut down versions from the retail units or the same as devkits.

They definitely can use more of their dies