What TV is this? I don’t believe there were any HDMI 2.1 models before 2020. Yours may support 120Hz at 1080p.
Most of the existing sets that have 120 Hz but not VRR only supports that refresh rate at lower resolutions like 1080p. Sony doesn’t support 1440p so that intermediate resolution is out too. I find it hard to believe that games can not hit 60 fps at the resolution of 1080p for current-gen consoles. That’s why I do not find the 40 FPS mode all that interesting with even more limited applications.
2 Likes
It supports 120Hz at 1440p with HDMI 2.0. I didn’t claim otherwise. Its a Samsung NU8009.
I think my main thing is that there is a big gap in the requirements to hit 60 vs 30 and nobody wants an unstable 60. 40 is a nice option for when you can’t hit 60 but can push past 30 without a problem.
Using 40 is not a game changer, but just an acknowledgement of new options provided by 120Hz that many of us think is clever because it isn’t something that occurred to us until Insomniac did it.
The options would be 4K @ 30 Hz or 1080p @ 40 Hz. With that large of a resolution drop you should be able to hit 1080p @ 60 Hz. At least that’s how I view the Sony non-VRR scenario.
To do 4K at 40 Hz you need a set with support for 4K @ 120 Hz which I’m 98% sure would also support VRR (provided its not labeled Sony).
3 Likes
I don’t have ton of experience with VRR (Sony TV here) but I have heard from some people that there are still some benefits of a fixed frame rate over a wildly fluctuating one with VRR.
If that’s true and you have the ability to hit 40fps in a mode that would be limited to 30fps typically, why not?
3 Likes
This scenario is very limited because of Sony’s lack of support for VRR.
What your talking about is a different situation. You would need a set with 4K @ 120 Hz support which means it really should have VRR support. Once it has VRR the game can pick any fixed refresh rate, it doesn’t have to be limited to 40 Hz and it doesn’t have to fluctuate at all. It could be locked to 44 or 48 or 52 or 42 or any number the devs desire.
For VRR you need at least 45fps and it doesn’t matter if it fluctuates over that.
VRR is all about frame times. There are certain FPS markers you can use as a heuristic, but ultimately it just comes down to frame times.
I really hope 40 doesn’t become popular because the first video that they featured it was giving me a headache. If games do that I will have to check videos of game play to make sure and hope vrr can smooth that problem out or just pass on those games.
Yeah I’m not sold at all on 40 but then I don’t have a 120HZ capable TV at 4K. I get it provides a clever option but could we ideally stick to 30,60, 120 and just design our games to hit those standard framerates please?
1 Like
With Xbox we at least can say they planning to go in that direction as they’ve invested into the tech to do so, the main problem though is going to be third party devs and how they choose to use or not use the tools. One of them could decide 40FPS is how they want their game to run and just do so and all we can do is choose between buying it because we’re looking forward to the game or not buy because we don’t like they’re choice of 40FPS
Not quite. It’s very set specific.
For instance the LG C9 has VRR range starting at 40 Hz.
Here’s what I found about Samsung sets, where they start at 48 Hz. Though they have LFC which extends it. I need to look into what Rtings says about LFC, as this is the first I’ve really seen it mentioned.
Samsung TV’s have a VRR range of 48-120Hz but also feature LFC (low frame rate compensation) like proper G-Sync monitors do so have an effective range of 20-120hz according to Rtings. But Samsung TV’s only have HDMI 2.0 ports so cannot do 4K 120hz.
Also newer LG CX and C1 sets have VRR well below 40 Hz, with RTings saying less than 20 Hz when LFC is enabled. https://www.reddit.com/r/OLED_Gaming/comments/ohg4hd/lg_cx_and_c1_is_now_confirmed_to_have_vrr_minimum/
1 Like
If you have a 120Hz set, 40fps should provide a signifigantly smoother experience and with major reductions in input lag over 30fps. It really is only an option now because it divides evenly with the refresh rate, like 30 and 60 do.
The point is 40Hz can now be a new standard as well. Why should 30/60/120 be the only options?
I really don’t get all of the apprehension to this option.
1 Like
My point is if you can do 4K @ 120Hz in order to get this 40 Hz non-VRR at 4K mode the set should be able to support arbitrary refresh rates since it also has VRR. I’m not against 40 Hz, I am saying the usefulness of how it’s being implemented in this particular scenario is quite silly. It really only benefits Sony sets which do not support VRR. Sony needs to simply implement VRR. Once they do, then so many more options become available. They could deliver consistent frame rates anywhere from 40 - 120 and not be stuck at whole number dividers of 120.
I agree that there is significant overlap among the two options. It does also sound like there is a fair amount of inconsistency in VRR implementation and capability across sets though, and an option like this might be nice to have until VRR becomes more mature.
2 Likes
My problem: It was giving me a headache from watching a video of the game running on 40, so I would still need vrr even with this new technique to get a good experience. While a game at 60 even when it has drops and no vrr I still feel I’m having a good experience.
I have to imagine a video of this is not going to give you a true indication of what it would be like running it on your own TV.