Xbox Acquisition |OT6| If this is about competition, let us have competition

[TheBrightestSun]

@Madumbrella

I was reading the post on resetera and there was a account with your name

Because it is me

[Madumbrella (Mad)]

@TheBrightestSun

Because it is me

Damm man, didnt knew you where on that platform aswell

[Privat33r]

@Madumbrella

Damm man, didnt knew you where on that platform aswell

crossplatform exists before consoles

[ParkerPetrov]

@WAHderfulGoldenStar

just a question, why? Like shouldn’t this logic apply to the west too where MS bought the biggest player. Not saying you are wrong, just curious for your reasoning here. I would assuming it would come more down to what MS decides to target where price is obviously a factor but not the end all be all

Activision blizzard is a special case. As if you look at the pre scandal value and the post scandal value you will see your answer. Even if with the premium they paid over the stock price it was still cheaper than pre scandal high. The company wasn’t magically worth less because of a tangible thing. It was all around press. So they basically got billions knocked off the cost for free and bought a company that is worth well above what they paid for it. However, you can’t exactly compare that purchase to other acquistions with that level of causation and correlation. As not every company Microsoft buys is part of scandal or struggling. ABK is an exception, not the rule.

The reasoning to the statement is why would pay more when you can buy the competitor for less unless in this case Capcom is providing something that is so wholly unique it cannot be obtained through any method other than acquisition. So it comes down to first what is microsofts goals?

1. They told us they want to reach 3 billion gamers. Thats partially marketing fluff but also a degree of truth is in the ideology of that statement itself.

2. So then its about how. Well we obviously proprietary hardware sales but also Service sales in the form of gamepass. As Microsoft as an entity is a subscription based company. Azure, Microsoft 365, GamePass, Cybersecurity holdings, etc. its all about month over month recurring revenue.

So how does capcom help you achieve firstly 1 then also 2. None of capcoms properties are demonstratively better in engagement and monthly active users then any of there competitors. Monster Hunter world is huge but it still has peaks valleys. Its not like Final Fantasy 14, Destiny, etc. where you are logging in daily and weekly by nature of the game. Monster Hunter has a longer tale then many other properties but to the level where it cannot be duplicated.

So then you look at can a competitor give me what I desire for less. In capcom’s case the answer is yes. There are other Japanese entities you can get for cheaper that would provide you a similar gain return in the long run.

@WAHderfulGoldenStar

Koie Tecmo is actually around the same price as Capcom and has 1 issue which I even overlooked. The Erikawa Family basically owns a majority share (45.7%) meaning if they don’t want to sell they could probably prevent it fairly easily, escpecially koei tecmo owns 6.29% of itself and on top of that another family (The Kakihara Family) owns 6.72% meaning if those 2 familys don’t want koei to be acquired they have enough power to vote against it

Koei tecmo though reached its peak in 2021 and now its declining year over year most likely back to 2017, 2018 value which was mostly flat around that time where capcom is increasing year over year. Even today tehy are about a billion dollars apart in just market cap and that gulf only looks to be widening. you will have to pay significantly more for capcom then koei tecmo and based on market trends moreso every day.

@WAHderfulGoldenStar

I mean the switch is still selling hand over fist and I believe PC is pretty popular there. Obvious mobile is dominate but that isn’t really shocking since it is dominate in most place if not everywhere since almost everyone owns a phone so I don’t think that is a sign of the downfall of AAA games in that market (just my 2 cent though)

Nowhere did I say we were seeing the downfall of triple A games. I just said AAA games don’t sell as well in Japan as they have in the past. So sales in western markets are more important to them than they ever have been.

[WAHderfulGoldenStar]

@ParkerPetrov

Activision blizzard is a special case. As if you look at the pre scandal value and the post scandal value you will see your answer. Even if with the premium they paid over the stock price it was still cheaper than pre scandal high. The company wasn’t magically worth less because of a tangible thing. It was all around press. So they basically got billions knocked off the cost for free and bought a company that is worth well above what they paid for it. However, you can’t exactly compare that purchase to other acquistions with that level of causation and correlation. As not every company Microsoft buys is part of scandal or struggling. ABK is an exception, not the rule.

The reasoning to the statement is why would pay more when you can buy the competitor for less unless in this case Capcom is providing something that is so wholly unique it cannot be obtained through any method other than acquisition. So it comes down to first what is microsofts goals?

1. They told us they want to reach 3 billion gamers. Thats partially marketing fluff but also a degree of truth is in the ideology of that statement itself.
2. So then its about how. Well we obviously proprietary hardware sales but also Service sales in the form of gamepass. As Microsoft as an entity is a subscription based company. Azure, Microsoft 365, GamePass, Cybersecurity holdings, etc. its all about month over month recurring revenue.

So how does capcom help you achieve firstly 1 then also 2. None of capcoms properties are demonstratively better in engagement and monthly active users then any of there competitors. Monster Hunter world is huge but it still has peaks valleys. Its not like Final Fantasy 14, Destiny, etc. where you are logging in daily and weekly by nature of the game. Monster Hunter has a longer tale then many other properties but to the level where it cannot be duplicated.

So then you look at can a competitor give me what I desire for less. In capcom’s case the answer is yes. There are other Japanese entities you can get for cheaper that would provide you a similar gain return in the long run.

huh, I won’t lie you make some really good points I have never considered.

@ParkerPetrov

Koei tecmo though reached its peak in 2021 and now its declining year over year most likely back to 2017, 2018 value which was mostly flat around that time where capcom is increasing year over year. Even today tehy are about a billion dollars apart in just market cap and that gulf only looks to be widening. you will have to pay significantly more for capcom then koei tecmo and based on market trends moreso every day.

this is ignoring the family part which could make it significantly more expensive if they don’t want to sell since you would basically need to money hat and koei tecmo is only about $0.17B behind Capcom’s market cap (koei tecmo is $5.57B and capcom is $5.75B) so basically identical but fair with the rest but you are also getting considerably less with them, at that point just go for SEGA or SE who are cheaper (Square costing $5.46B and Sammy SEGA costing $3.27B in terms of market cap).

@ParkerPetrov

Nowhere did I say we were seeing the downfall of triple A games. I just said AAA games don’t sell as well in Japan as they have in the past. So sales in western markets are more important to them than they ever have been.

ah, sorry miss understood

[TheBrightestSun]

@ParkerPetrov

So how does capcom help you achieve firstly 1 then also 2. None of capcoms properties are demonstratively better in engagement and monthly active users then any of there competitors

They provide a set of relatively big IPs with a loyal following. In general none of japanese publishers (aside Square Enix) help to achieve any of those 2 points.

[DARK-PARADISE]

@TheBrightestSun

Because it is me

Resetera ban speedrun record incoming

[Paxton]

Snoy: NOOOOOOOOOOOO YOU CAN’T BUY COWADOODY ITS A GENRE ITSELF

Microchad: Seethe and Cope.

[Madumbrella (Mad)]

@Paxton

Snoy: NOOOOOOOOOOOO YOU CAN’T BUY COWADOODY ITS A GENRE ITSELF

Microchad: Seethe and Cope.

Apparently they put cod higher than gta, so there is no problem for xbox to go for take two then

[WAHderfulGoldenStar]

@Madumbrella

Apparently they put cod higher than gta

I would put CoD above GTA for 1 reason. It is annual, we basically just get 1 rockstar game a gen at this point and 1 GTA a decade while a new CoD comes out every year. Being honest, the only thing that matches that are sports games and some nintendo stuff like pokemon

[Madumbrella (Mad)]

@WAHderfulGoldenStar

I would put CoD above GTA for 1 reason. It is annual, we basically just get 1 rockstar game a gen at this point and 1 GTA a decade while a new CoD comes out every year. Being honest, the only thing that matches that are sports games and some nintendo stuff like pokemon

I though the revennue of gta 5 sales was bigger than the annual releases of cod

[TheBrightestSun]

@Madumbrella

I though the revennue of gta 5 sales was bigger than the annual releases of cod

Not sure about that. Last time it was mentioned that 2K (NBA mainly) generates more revenue than GTA.

[Cairnst (Bill Cairns)]

@WAHderfulGoldenStar

I would put CoD above GTA for 1 reason. It is annual, we basically just get 1 rockstar game a gen at this point and 1 GTA a decade while a new CoD comes out every year. Being honest, the only thing that matches that are sports games and some nintendo stuff like pokemon

I was going to argue with you on that because GTA V has sold like 160 million copies and that is insane - but looking it up the information I could find shows that Call of Duty has sold 425 million over the entire franchise whereas GTA has sold 380 million. I’d imagine there’s additional revenue such as DLC or microtransactions that would have to be accounted for so it’s hard to say for sure, but it does look like CoD is actually the bigger franchise and it would indeed be because of the more regular release schedule. Huh.

[TheBrightestSun]

@Cairnst

I could find shows that Call of Duty has sold 425 million over the entire franchise whereas GTA has sold 380 million

Considering that COD has been an annual franchise I wonder how many copies it has sold since GTA5 release (2013)

[Madumbrella (Mad)]

@TheBrightestSun

Not sure about that. Last time it was mentioned that 2K (NBA mainly) generates more revenue than GTA.

Well I am surprised by that, I always though gta 5 was the titan in t2 revennue

[TheBrightestSun]

@Madumbrella

Well I am surprised by that, I always though gta 5 was the titan in t2 revennue

sports are crazy profitable. Consider this - 70% of EA revenue comes from MTX and most of it from Ultimate Team and most of it from FIFA.

[Cairnst (Bill Cairns)]

@TheBrightestSun

Not sure about that. Last time it was mentioned that 2K (NBA mainly) generates more revenue than GTA.

This might vary depending on year wouldn’t it? If it’s counting GTAV’s current yearly revenue nearly a decade after launch against yearly sports franchises it wouldn’t surprise me, but the numbers for overall revenue might show a bigger difference.

@TheBrightestSun

Considering that COD has been an annual franchise I wonder how many copies it has sold since GTA5 release (2013)

I don’t have ALL the numbers but what I could find suggests sales of between 14 and 29 million on post-GTAV Call of duty games. Just doing some really lazy maths I’ll say an average of 20.9 million per game (based on the few games I could find numbers for, so this is by no means completely accurate since I don’t have ALL of the numbers) and with 9 mainline entries that makes a (very) rough estimate of 188 million sales. This doesn’t include the remastered releases of Modern Warfare 1 and 2 though so they’d be factored in too, and of course Warzone is a whole separate thing. For reference GTAV has sold 165 million copies.

[TheBrightestSun]

@Cairnst

This might vary depending on year wouldn’t it? If it’s counting GTAV’s current yearly revenue nearly a decade after launch against yearly sports franchises it wouldn’t surprise me, but the numbers for overall revenue might show a bigger difference.

I am talking about yearly revenue. I think NBA and GTA are relatively stable in their revenue (still crazy that people buy it).

@Cairnst

I don’t have ALL the numbers but what I could find suggests sales of between 14 and 29 million on post-GTAV Call of duty games. Just doing some really lazy maths I’ll say an average of 20.9 million per game (based on the few games I could find numbers for, so this is by no means completely accurate since I don’t have ALL of the numbers) and with 9 mainline entries that makes a (very) rough estimate of 188 million sales. This doesn’t include the remastered releases of Modern Warfare 1 and 2 though so they’d be factored in too, and of course Warzone is a whole separate thing. For reference GTAV has sold 165 million copies.

Sold a lot.

[Madumbrella (Mad)]

@TheBrightestSun

sports are crazy profitable. Consider this - 70% of EA revenue comes from MTX and most of it from Ultimate Team and most of it from FIFA.

Now I understand more why xbox have been trying to get sports games on gamepass, it only needs a deal with those leagues and ta-da, Sports games on gamepass

Still it would be cool to see xbox getting someone like ea or take for everything else besides the sports, even someone like konami will be crazy, they could always use MLG to give more exposure to their sports games meanwhile xbox gets them on gamepass

Because the fifa scene in my country is CRAZY

[WAHderfulGoldenStar]

@Cairnst

I was going to argue with you on that because GTA V has sold like 160 million copies and that is insane - but looking it up the information I could find shows that Call of Duty has sold 425 million over the entire franchise whereas GTA has sold 380 million. I’d imagine there’s additional revenue such as DLC or microtransactions that would have to be accounted for so it’s hard to say for sure, but it does look like CoD is actually the bigger franchise and it would indeed be because of the more regular release schedule. Huh.

yeah CoD is a power house.

@Madumbrella

Now I understand more why xbox have been trying to get sports games on gamepass, it only needs a deal with those leagues and ta-da, Sports games on gamepass

yeah I think MS wants to stuff most of the casual games on game pass and when I think of casual games sports games are just after CoD for me