I’m curious if you’ve got any insight on this, but why would internal devs use Forge instead of their standard tools? Is it faster than the internal tools, or do they do stuff like this to highlight the capabilities of Forge?
I think it is partly due to showing the capabilities of Forge. Clearly, there seems to be a much smaller visual gap between a standard map and a Forge map (when done well) this time around.
2 Likes
I look at a game like gears 5 which had more than 20 dlc maps in its first two years to go along tons of cosmetic dlc and I think how can the coalition pump that much content out while 343 can only put a fraction of that amount out despite more people working on halo. Is the unreal engine just that good?
Most games only get big dlc for 2+ years if they are really popular. Gears 5 stopped at 2 years. Of all the halo games halo 3 had the longest support and that was only 2 years. The only games that get support for longer than two years are the incredibly popular games like Fortnite, and warzone. And even warzone is being replaced at 2.5 years. We supposed to believe that infinite will have even longer support than halo 3 and COD Warzone?
Edit- I agree the pit looks great, but would have gone with something a bit different.
Isn’t that what GaaS is all about? Two years is nothing when you look at Sea of Thieves (2018), Destiny 2 (2017) and plenty of other GaaS games. Pretty sure there are reasons they had to go from Warzone to Warzone 2 (technical debt maybe?) or they wouldnt have bothered.
Most GAAS games don’t get support past two years especially versus shooters. Only the really successful ones. I think destiny has lasted this long mostly because of the co-op side of things. Their versus is a joke.
Well yeah, if your user base isn’t large enough to justify continued investment then the sustaining will get cut short.
I think Microsoft will keep pushing Halo Infinite for MP, the most they’ll do is a “relaunch”. There isn’t a ton of reason to start over with a new game if you’ve split the MP into a f2p game.
Those are two great examples of GAAS games. Both of those games have received huge amounts of support. That’s what halo needs to thrive . From the roadmap we know that infinite still won’t be getting that support till atleast next may unfortunately.
I agree with what you said in your later post also. Doesn’t make a lot of sense to release a sequel anytime soon. A relaunch of infinite makes more sense. I don’t want to see that until 343 is able to put out steady content though, 2024 or later. A big campaign dlc with some minor to moderate gameplay changes and dare I say a graphics update.
Maybe forge will be good enough that 343 won’t need to dedicate resources to dev tool made maps. It looks like making a map takes 6-8 months for start to finish right now.
1 Like
Gears 5 multiplayer maps were subcontracted to Splash Damage who made Gears Tactics…in addition, I know just as many assholes on the internet complained that 7 maps wasn’t enough for Gears 5 either and they were wrong in the end.
Generally speaking it doesn’t matter what they think. Once CO-OP and Forge(and thus a plethora of maps) are in they will complain about not having specific playlists or specific armor set or how a weapon is not exactly as good or nerfed as it was in a previous game.
A lot of them don’t actually want Halo to be good, they want troll ammo to complain about it.
Gears 5 had a ton of content at launch and good support for its run. It also had a toxic, pvp oriented, vocal minority abusing devs though. The rest of us who enjoyed the campaign and the very fun PvE-content had a great time.
Halo Infinite is light on everything.
1 Like
It had a ton of dlc. More than 20 maps. Bunch of escape maps. Cosmetic dlc. Campaign dlc. Really quite astounding how much content they put out in two years after launch.
That’s what halo needs.
1 Like
It also had a, imo, fun progression system(s). Very important.
Yeah. I fully agree. I spent 2000 hours in it. Its my most played game of all time.
You had a great campaign, Horde, PVP, Split-screen, co-op and escape and what I consider to be probably the Xbox Ones best visuals. The game really raised The Coallition from being the guys who inherited Gears to possibly the most proficient studio on the planet.
And it got shit just because it had 7 maps…like…what is the cut off point. Would there be no complaints if it had 11?
IMO Infinite could have launched in 2020, with 15 maps, co-op, split-screen, forge etc…I still know some folk are going to bitch about something. Someone online told me once, Halo is the Avatar of Xbox (even though Microsoft has bigger games now) and so a lot of haters online will bash it because they believe if Halo is doing bad, Xbox is.
1 Like
Yeah, I think there is some overlap between the toxic parts of those communities lol.
I loved Gears 5. Bought the Xbox One X LE console and everything, even though I allready had an X. It was great. The Coalition is damn good.
1 Like
Gears 5 was also developed and released prior to the pandemic, so many of those workflows that go into post-release support were already miles ahead relative to Halo’s situation (game and proprietary engine developed during the pandemic, at least one contracting studio cut off due to the war in Ukraine, etc.). Why are we having this same conversation, making erroneous comparisons?
5 Likes
Gears 5 and Infinite are both completely different beasts.
I don’t think that’s a fair comparison to 343 at all.
6 Likes
I think it’s a perfectly fair comparison to be made. One of Xbox’s best studios put out around 25 maps, campaign dlc obviously with the help of support studios. Another one of Xbox’s main studios using more staff put out a fraction, and I mean a fraction of the content. They are on pace to release maybe 1/3(that’s generous) the content that the coalition did.
You’re missing a bunch of context though.
I get it, I think 343 really dropped the ball with Infinite as well and honestly with Halo in general.
But they’re trying their best man, like I’m not sure what else they can say to make everybody happy again. They know they fucked up and have acknowledged it multiple of times. They’re trying to address the issues within 343 in a healthy manner and that’s all we can really hope for at this point.
1 Like
It’s not a perfectly fair comparison to make, even when you disregard all the issues 343i faced (self-made or otherwise). Hell, just the fact that Gears is made via Unreal, which immediately removes the initial onboarding barriers for dev, is one of the biggest reasons it’s an asinine comparison.
Based on your recent post history though, it’s clear you just have a bone to pick and aren’t interested in a good-faith discussion surrounding differences in development.
2 Likes
A good number of the 343i headcount are not game developers though. Also, you are ignoring the pandemic effect as well.
2 Likes
I agree with this 100%. I just think most people here want to act like their is no problem and the few of us that acknowledge it and wonder what’s going on are blasted.
I love the game. But theres like 5 maps in ranked, a huge desync problem, and no stat tracking. This was once Microsoft’s flagship IP, and now feels like an afterthought.