The Big ol' Xbox 3rd Party Releases Discussion Thread (HiFi, SoT, Pentiment, Grounded) (Part 2)

[Xplainin]

@TheLegendaryGamer

None of their games made any profit. Redfall failed, Hi-Fi Rush although reviews high but failed sales wise. Dishonored and Prey failed sales and money wise. The Evil within and Ghostwire also failed sales and money wise. Making no money while burning money has to be a part of the reason they were closed down.

This is why i believe the decision are being made by the Tops at Microsoft and not Phil Spencer.

From now on if the games are not making enough money? Watch out cause they not gone to keep a studio around just burning away money while making zero profit in return.

Then again that falls on MS and not the studio. MS has preached for the longest that GP is what its all about. Player engagement is what matter, not sales. You cant put a game on GP and then complain it didnt sell enough. Thats total bullshit. To come out and say how well it did for you, and then close the studio is an even bigger self own. Lets just face facts. They were five or six years away from releasing another game, and MS didnt want to finance the studio during that period of time. Its as simple as that.

[Andodalf]

@Xplainin

Tango were already working on their new game. They were trying to get the greenlight for another HiFi, not another game from scratch. The main team was already on a new project, most likely Ghostwire 2, as hinted by the MS leaks Game studios dont work on one game, and then when its finished they sit around trying to pitch a new game. The idea that the entire Tango team was sitting around playing solitaire waiting on the greenlight for HiFi 2 is just silly. They would have been balls deep into another project the minute Ghostwire shipped. We all know they didnt spend much time on the Xbox port of it.

The Ghostwire team helped finish Hifi.

[Vonterribad (Matt)]

@Widey85

…S Plus even though that will now have a similar draw for non-casual gamers? Also, some genres are stronger in certain regions, and we know while Xbox hasn’t been completely outsold in the USA/UK it’s been soundly beaten numbers wise in mainland Europe. It may also be Xbox seems to have a higher enthusiast to casual ratio than PlayStation - so we’re less likely to buy some mainstream games, and also more likely to read reviews and not buy unfinished games (which let’s face it, so many nowadays are). Basically there’s lots of reasons some games may sell way better on PlayStation - and by admitting the big franchises still do the numbers on Xbox he’s admitting we do buy games, but is using his own bias against Game Pass plus the fact it’ll go down well on the other eras and earn him their love…

I mean Sony themselves have said their model isn’t working, but that somehow gets forgotten in all these…‘discussions’

[strawman]

@Xplainin

Then again that falls on MS and not the studio. MS has preached for the longest that GP is what its all about. Player engagement is what matter, not sales.

What if the player engagement is low despite the game being on Game Pass?

[monkeyboy101 (Davis)]

@Joe_Sinister1

Hopefully Sony will actually start releasing new games at some point so you don’t regret your purchase

They wont. The PS5 game drought is persistant and only going to get worse. The PS6 …wooo boy, thats going to be barren. Thankfully Xbox saw this coming and made major investments.

Sad thing is, no-ones buying any games. Not even viral sensations (Helldivers is 80% Steam) nor high rated games like FFVIIR 2.

Eventually, Xbox will realise that and stop bothering.

[Vonterribad (Matt)]

@strawman

What if the player engagement is low despite the game being on Game Pass?

I will NEVER defend the Tango shutdown; waste of talent and honestly, that is shame on MS (booty), frankly.

GP shinobi stuff is bunk; what people do have a point is they would have had another project in production. The money bag on Ghostwire, as well as the exclusivity, was not enough to warrant a sequel?

[Widey85]

@Vonterribad

I mean Sony themselves have said their model isn’t working, but that somehow gets forgotten in all these…‘discussions’

Yep it’s also getting really tiring that every “insider” is taken at face value when many have shown themselves to favour PlayStation over the years (who can blame them I guess - it’s got the bigger user base so anti-Xbox / pro-PS gets more engagement) or have zero credentials.

It appears every slight rumour, opinion or unsubstantiated / ancient “fact” about Xbox by these “insiders” (real and fake ones) is being taken as gospel to allow fears to run into overdrive - instead of waiting and seeing what the truth is.

For example the “Microsoft is pushing for no red line” suddenly became “Microsoft has no red line” - the former suggests they’re getting pushback but because that doesn’t fit with narratives, so the latter allows them to say “everything is going almost immediately”.

I’m very skeptical of anyone who’s certain of Xbox’s strategy is when even they don’t seem to know it entirely…

And yes agreed, even Sony have admitted the ever-growing demand for better graphics is no longer profitable for them and they’re going to concentrate on immersive narratives instead - everyone is having to adapt as more and more players play 7+ year old games and don’t buy new ones

[Got-A-Stew-Going]

I have yet to see any receipts regarding shinobi’s anti Xbox bias.

[monkeyboy101 (Davis)]

@Xplainin

Then again that falls on MS and not the studio. MS has preached for the longest that GP is what its all about. Player engagement is what matter, not sales. You cant put a game on GP and then complain it didnt sell enough. Thats total bullshit.

Whenever someone shows Steam numbers against a game pass release is an admission of failure. Its going to be amusing to see with CoD this year.

[Fiendflag]

@Xplainin

I agree. I have my XSX, and I will be buying a PS5 Pro when its released. I will no longer buy any games on the Xbox console, and will.just use GP for their first party games that are exclusive, and the rest I will buy on PS. I know that Sony is more dedicated to the PS than MS is to Xbox.

I personally don’t see how supporting Sony is supposed to be a good alternative but do what you think is best for you. There is a reason why I chose Xbox again as my main platform with the Series X over the PS5, Sony is a company that nickels and dimes their fanbase (yes even more than Nintendo) with the 80 euros price raise and selling patches that the rest of the industry gave for free so they can fuck off, let alone their lackluster ecosystem (sub-par backwards compatibility, closing serves like it’s nothing, overpriced subscriptions e.t.c.) so yeah I am not supporting any of this shit any time soon…

That being said I am adjusting my buying habits as I see fit on Xbox after the recent change of plans/strategy, I am riding with SX till the end of the gen and I’ll act accordingly next generation after (hopefully) they will clear all this messaging mess and explain some things better. Until then I will play every 1st and 3rd party game that interests me on my SX just fine.

[Vonterribad (Matt)]

@Got-A-Stew-Going

I have yet to see any receipts regarding shinobi’s anti Xbox bias.

I don’t think he is biased. I just find it funny I point out Ghostwire flopped as a PS5 exclusive enough to not warrant a sequel and its crickets. Give me my receipts first. He just a guy with an opinion and often comes down on the wrong side of it.

[Widey85]

@Got-A-Stew-Going

I have yet to see any receipts regarding shinobi’s anti Xbox bias.

I’ve yet to see any that what he’s saying isn’t just bullshit designed to farm engagement on there.

He played Starfield and maybe HiFi Rush but he seems to have played every single PlayStation first party game so consciously or not he may have a slight preference that way.

But most of all, in the last few months he’s really not helped the narrative - he’s convinced Xbox is going full third party, he’s said Game Pass is changing / going up in price for CoD and many other takes that just seem to be jumping on the bandwagon with his takes not backed up by “insiders” with much closer links to Xbox.

This latest post just feeds further into PlayStation fanboys obsession with “Game Pass destroying gaming” and without actual figures and other causes being ruled out I’m not going to take it seriously

[KakkaKarrotKake]

@Xplainin

In typical MS fashion, what will happen is that they will tank the console, and in 10 years time, just like they did with the windows phone, they will say it was a mistake and they should have kept pushing the console.

Honestly, I think this is unlikely, consoles are becoming less and less appealing every year and gen Z and beyond simply don’t care about them, apparantly 92% of new gen play mobile games, it’s clear where things are headed

Does that mean consoles are going to die, no, they will likely still have a place but their importance will become less and less over the next decade and beyond

Something to also remember is that revenue you’re talking about being higher than Xbox + ABK doesn’t mean much when we know their profit margins are absolutely horrid and that 30% cut that everybody talks about is actually much less because of all the costs involved that we never hear about

[Andodalf]

@Vonterribad

I will NEVER defend the Tango shutdown; waste of talent and honestly, that is shame on MS (booty), frankly.

GP shinobi stuff is bunk; what people do have a point is they would have had another project in production. The money bag on Ghostwire, as well as the exclusivity, was not enough to warrant a sequel?

The entire issue with tango is that they didn’t. The Ghostwire team helped finish Hifi. And even with that, they were going to have to staff up for a sequel. Ghostwire flopped hard as hell, they may have had planned to do a sequel in 2020, but by the time Ghostwire came out it was clear as day they were done with it after the Xbox port.

[monkeyboy101 (Davis)]

@Widey85

This latest post just feeds further into PlayStation fanboys obsession with “Game Pass destroying gaming” and without actual figures and other causes being ruled out I’m not going to take it seriously

Playstation fans are mortified, because they all know, god of war, spider-man, wolverine. Will always be distant 3rd or 4th or 5th behind CoD, Nintendos big game + adjacent titles and that gap gets wider with every year.

And thats before game pass. Sony has a first party problem money cant fix.

The big games Sony announces this year are 2 -3 CoDs away. So embaressing.

Game pass adds 9m subscribers in 2 years “Stalled, stagnant rah rah” . PSN+ hasnt added a member in 5 years despite combining PSnow and Sony hid the numbers after the price hike “Wow. So much success, they are hiding them for a good reason”

[TheLegendaryGamer]

@Xplainin

Then again that falls on MS and not the studio. MS has preached for the longest that GP is what its all about. Player engagement is what matter, not sales. You cant put a game on GP and then complain it didnt sell enough. Thats total bullshit. To come out and say how well it did for you, and then close the studio is an even bigger self own. Lets just face facts. They were five or six years away from releasing another game, and MS didnt want to finance the studio during that period of time. Its as simple as that.

I don’t believe Phil Spencer or Sarah Bond have the power to actually closed game studios. That comes at the higher ups at Microsoft and not the people of Xbox Gaming division.

Not trying to defend the Xbox gaming division people for saying what they said about the success of Hi-Fi. To the people at Xbox division they might see Hi-Fi as a success while the higher ups at Microsoft see it different.

Again i don’t believe Phil Spencer or Sarah Bond are the ones making the decision to closed down them studios.

Tango and Arkane Austin history of not making any profit from the games they make go way back. They were making no money even before Microsoft ever bought them.

Things have change with the higher ups at Microsoft regarding how Gamepass impact sales and profit. It’s why everything is gone to go multi-plat eventually.

[Staffy]

I’ve been seeing the word 3DO thrown around a lot since these new rumors about what the next Xbox will be. I’ve never had one, never did much info checking on it either but apparently if MS is gonna do this it’s gonna be like 3DO? Of course hopefully with a better outcome.

We can’t blame MS here I guess, the consoles aren’t working, I get them wanting to try something else. Even if it apparently isn’t something new at all.

[monkeyboy101 (Davis)]

@Staffy

I’ve been seeing the word 3DO thrown around a lot since these new rumors about what the next Xbox will be. I’ve never had one, never did much info checking on it either but apparently if MS is gonna do this it’s gonna be like 3DO?

Its gonna be like the Steamdeck or a laptop. Valve doesnt care if Steamdeck sells 100m or not, it will always have a library and always have support because Steam does. To them its just another PC. They saw the switch and thought “hmm, we could do that”…and boom, its immediately a better handheld than the Switch, more power, better library.

Likewise Windows will always be top dog in HD gaming , The PS6 will always be second choice to Windows.

[Andodalf]

@Xplainin

Then again that falls on MS and not the studio. MS has preached for the longest that GP is what its all about. Player engagement is what matter, not sales. You cant put a game on GP and then complain it didnt sell enough. Thats total bullshit. To come out and say how well it did for you, and then close the studio is an even bigger self own. Lets just face facts. They were five or six years away from releasing another game, and MS didnt want to finance the studio during that period of time. Its as simple as that.

Less than 10% of GP members played HIfi. It had terrible engagement numbers. And it was never supposed to be the breadwinner for tango anyway.

Pentiment did okay for a tiny game with a dev count in the teens. Imagine if it had to support all of obsidian! Instead they had another small game and two big ones.

[BadNews]

@Xplainin

If it did well, MS would have released their traditional “2 million people have played HB2”, or something similar. We have had nothing of the type. To me that speaks volumes.

True, they usually tell you within the first 2 weeks how many people have played a game. We’ll see if they do that for Hellblade or maybe they’ll stop reporting that